I’m always taking the side of harm reduction, but that’s pretty much reserved for when you’re in the voting booth and there’s nothing else to be done. I’m some rando from overseas, but this applies everywhere in the world where you can still vote.
Before elections is the time to take action so you don’t end up having to choose between evils
But you still made the comment you did. As I said, criticism is and has always been allowed.
Criticism by itself doesn’t accomplish anything. Sure, mollifying centrists has not been ideal, but unless there’s an actionable alternative, it’s the best we’ve got at the moment. I’m all for alternatives, I just see a lot of social inertia and none of the alternatives I see are capable of offering a better outcome in the face of that inertia.
If you have a suggestion to elevate progressives into office, I would sincerely love to hear it; that is my preferred outcome. But complaining about the dominant strategy without offering an actionable alternative is, as the top comment identified, splitting the left.
You know how you move them left? By picking horrific policies like this, criticizing them heavily, and then getting rid of the politicians who support them. That’s how you move left. It’s not a magical thing you do. It’s this right here.
You’re not going to believe this, but guess what’s happening right now?
Though I’m going to push back on that a little bit actually. It’s important you keep doing it the rest of the time too. Pressure has to be constant if you want to move a party. You don’t do it by sitting on your ass for all but two months of the year. The only way you can consistently steer a political party is by consistent pressure. So we need to never stop. Cuz guess who doesn’t stop, guess who doesn’t follow your advice, the neoliberals and their billionaire backers.
Yeah we probably disagree on what right wing means. I hope you’re not throwing your vote away every year, because that is not helpful and we need help right now!
I’m old enough to have seen that tried many times now, and look where we’re at.
I think it’s time for something different, and we can start by not championing centrists, or attacking/shaming people on the left who do criticize them.
We should have had a primary. I’ll never forgive Biden for that.
I also don’t forgive people who knew better and still didn’t vote for the only viable alternative to Trump.
We have to put together a winning coalition to get these monsters out of power, but that coalition isn’t going to line perfectly with your or my politics. If it did, it would alienate a lot of people to our right, which is probably at least 90% of the country in both our cases. Somebody has to hold their nose and vote for the lesser of two evils.
Best I can do is offer you a choice between a candidate who’s a devout Zionist, but a Democrat, and a candidate who’s actually anti-semitic, but is being blackmailed by Israel, so their policies are even more Zionist.
Are you seriously bringing back this bullshit slogan from half a decade ago? I swear to god, BlueMAGA dems have literally convinced themselves that it’s 2020 and the Biden administration didn’t happen. What else can you do, I suppose? It categorically demonstrated that the “we can move them left!” Was bullshit.
It’s happening now
Oh, it’s happening now is it? Not during the year and a half of open genocide that the Democratic party oversaw? Just now, when they’re out of power? And in a “big way” huh? And yet not a single person within the party who participated in Isreals genocide has faced any consequence. Not even a slap on the wrist, let alone the trial and execution these monsters deserve.
This a farce at this point. Charlie Brown could tell you to stop trying to kick that football.
Do you even pay attention to the podcasts you brainwash yourself with? Chapo Trap House has said multiple times recently that Democrats are finally getting the message that their base has shifted massively against Israel.
Get ready for a lot of left-splitting posts like this as the midterms get nearer.
Uhh isn’t this exactly what we need before the primaries?
Everytime someone would point out how shitty some of these Dem candidates are we are told “save it for the primaries”. Well here we are.
I’m always taking the side of harm reduction, but that’s pretty much reserved for when you’re in the voting booth and there’s nothing else to be done. I’m some rando from overseas, but this applies everywhere in the world where you can still vote.
Before elections is the time to take action so you don’t end up having to choose between evils
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Absolutely primary these guys, but remember that most incumbents will win their primaries.
Because big tent politics and capitulating to centrist/right-wing Democrats has worked out so well for us.
What is your actionable alternative?
Allowing criticism from the left and recognizing that American centrists are right-wingers by another name, no matter their party affiliation.
Criticism has always been allowed, you’re doing it now. How do you actually secure a better alternative?
The top comment is calling this post left splitting, and implying that this type criticism is dangerous/nefarious.
And that’s the comment I was responding to.
But you still made the comment you did. As I said, criticism is and has always been allowed.
Criticism by itself doesn’t accomplish anything. Sure, mollifying centrists has not been ideal, but unless there’s an actionable alternative, it’s the best we’ve got at the moment. I’m all for alternatives, I just see a lot of social inertia and none of the alternatives I see are capable of offering a better outcome in the face of that inertia.
If you have a suggestion to elevate progressives into office, I would sincerely love to hear it; that is my preferred outcome. But complaining about the dominant strategy without offering an actionable alternative is, as the top comment identified, splitting the left.
“Sure we keep eating shit doing it, but it’s the ‘dominant strategy’ so it’s forbid to criticize it!”
In a two party system, a small tent is no tent. We can move the Democrats left. It’s happening now, in a big way, on the Israel issue.
You know how you move them left? By picking horrific policies like this, criticizing them heavily, and then getting rid of the politicians who support them. That’s how you move left. It’s not a magical thing you do. It’s this right here.
That’s fine for the primaries
You’re not going to believe this, but guess what’s happening right now?
Though I’m going to push back on that a little bit actually. It’s important you keep doing it the rest of the time too. Pressure has to be constant if you want to move a party. You don’t do it by sitting on your ass for all but two months of the year. The only way you can consistently steer a political party is by consistent pressure. So we need to never stop. Cuz guess who doesn’t stop, guess who doesn’t follow your advice, the neoliberals and their billionaire backers.
You say, already complaining about people criticising the democrats before the primaries have even started.
To the Democratic party, big tent politics means right-wing politics, and if you don’t know that by now, I’m not sure what to tell you.
Yeah we probably disagree on what right wing means. I hope you’re not throwing your vote away every year, because that is not helpful and we need help right now!
Vote blue no matter who?
I’m old enough to have seen that tried many times now, and look where we’re at.
I think it’s time for something different, and we can start by not championing centrists, or attacking/shaming people on the left who do criticize them.
similarly, when it comes down to general elections i hope we can recognize value of harm reduction versus purity contests
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Have you not been watching Gavin vetoing the what he or his donors don’t like in California after the people pass them like that?? Nm
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Have you not noticed them failing to get support over the last 13+ years by trying the same strategy over and over again?
Why should we keep doing more of the same if it hasn’t worked? I don’t get this logic?
We didn’t try it in 2024. How do you rate the results of that one?
What are you talking about?
The Democrats ran the centrist (again), and vote blue no matter who was the mantra everywhere I looked.
The voters that didn’t fail Kamala.
The voters didn’t fail the Democratic party.
Kamla and the Democratic party failed the voters.
We should have had a primary. I’ll never forgive Biden for that.
I also don’t forgive people who knew better and still didn’t vote for the only viable alternative to Trump.
We have to put together a winning coalition to get these monsters out of power, but that coalition isn’t going to line perfectly with your or my politics. If it did, it would alienate a lot of people to our right, which is probably at least 90% of the country in both our cases. Somebody has to hold their nose and vote for the lesser of two evils.
Stop supporting genocide
Best I can do is offer you a choice between a candidate who’s a devout Zionist, but a Democrat, and a candidate who’s actually anti-semitic, but is being blackmailed by Israel, so their policies are even more Zionist.
Are you seriously bringing back this bullshit slogan from half a decade ago? I swear to god, BlueMAGA dems have literally convinced themselves that it’s 2020 and the Biden administration didn’t happen. What else can you do, I suppose? It categorically demonstrated that the “we can move them left!” Was bullshit.
Oh, it’s happening now is it? Not during the year and a half of open genocide that the Democratic party oversaw? Just now, when they’re out of power? And in a “big way” huh? And yet not a single person within the party who participated in Isreals genocide has faced any consequence. Not even a slap on the wrist, let alone the trial and execution these monsters deserve.
This a farce at this point. Charlie Brown could tell you to stop trying to kick that football.
Do you even pay attention to the podcasts you brainwash yourself with? Chapo Trap House has said multiple times recently that Democrats are finally getting the message that their base has shifted massively against Israel.
Yeah they are getting the fact that their base has shifted so they are just trying harder to get more right wing voters and be the “other” choice.
Just cause they see it doesnt mean they care to change in the way you want. This is the Epstein class after all.
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Republicans and those who think pod saves America should be listen too?
“The Democrats have changed! A podcast I don’t like said so!”
Criticism, it’s called criticism.
How does it feel to have learned absolutely nothing for over a decade?
That’s the idea. That or convince fence sitters to not vote.
“Do not criticize the Party!”